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	<title>Comments on: Creationism as a GOP Litmus Test?</title>
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	<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/</link>
	<description>Musings on Science, Religion and Philosophy</description>
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		<title>By: Mark D.</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3060</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Oct 2009 20:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3060</guid>
		<description>Many commentators attribute the success of the Democratic party in congressional races in the past two elections to recruiting conservative candidates in conservative districts.

The liberal Democrats cannot have it both ways - they either learn how to compromise in the context of a more politically diverse majority, or live with a smaller number of ideological diehards.

So I can&#039;t say I have a lot of sympathy for the inability of Emanuel or whoever to demand perfect ideological conformity within his party. Politics is the art of the possible, as they say, and a lot of left leaning Democrats seem to be in denial on that point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Many commentators attribute the success of the Democratic party in congressional races in the past two elections to recruiting conservative candidates in conservative districts.</p>
<p>The liberal Democrats cannot have it both ways &#8211; they either learn how to compromise in the context of a more politically diverse majority, or live with a smaller number of ideological diehards.</p>
<p>So I can&#8217;t say I have a lot of sympathy for the inability of Emanuel or whoever to demand perfect ideological conformity within his party. Politics is the art of the possible, as they say, and a lot of left leaning Democrats seem to be in denial on that point.</p>
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		<title>By: Clark</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3049</link>
		<dc:creator>Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Oct 2009 05:38:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3049</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t mean to imply that Matheson doesn&#039;t believe what he votes.  (I have no way of knowing but he doesn&#039;t strike me as the cynical pandering type)  My point is more that his district would select someone for whom it doesn&#039;t require a lot of bravery here.  Maybe I am underestimating the pressure of his peers in congress.  But I think you are underestimating the pressure from the voters himself.  Indeed this is why I think Obama&#039;s real struggle has always been with Blue Dog Democrats and &lt;i&gt;thats&lt;/i&gt; why I think Rahm Emanuel was brought on last year.  (And I&#039;m pretty sure I said so at the time)  Emanuel has the ability to up the pressure you mentioned.  But I think even with Emanuel&#039;s tricks and tactics that the voters still have a great deal of influence - probably more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t mean to imply that Matheson doesn&#8217;t believe what he votes.  (I have no way of knowing but he doesn&#8217;t strike me as the cynical pandering type)  My point is more that his district would select someone for whom it doesn&#8217;t require a lot of bravery here.  Maybe I am underestimating the pressure of his peers in congress.  But I think you are underestimating the pressure from the voters himself.  Indeed this is why I think Obama&#8217;s real struggle has always been with Blue Dog Democrats and <i>thats</i> why I think Rahm Emanuel was brought on last year.  (And I&#8217;m pretty sure I said so at the time)  Emanuel has the ability to up the pressure you mentioned.  But I think even with Emanuel&#8217;s tricks and tactics that the voters still have a great deal of influence &#8211; probably more.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark D.</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3046</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Oct 2009 02:06:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3046</guid>
		<description>Clark, I think you underestimate the amount of social pressure that other members of Congress not to mention the Washington establishment and the media at large can bring to bear on an outlier in a political party, especially a right leaning one.

In this case we cannot tell the true extent without knowing Matheson&#039;s private feelings on the subject.  If he thinks that cap and trade in the form it came out of his committee is a wonderful thing, then his resistance to the pressure of his partisan peers would certainly be more a matter of self-interest than genuine moral courage.

However, as a general rule, I suggest that partisan outliers such as the Blue Dog Democrats typically have political inclinations that very much match the electorate that selected them.  Any electorate has every motivation to select the real McCoy rather than someone whose votes are little more than a matter of political opportunism.  Not that they are always successful, of course.  The recent election is an excellent case in point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Clark, I think you underestimate the amount of social pressure that other members of Congress not to mention the Washington establishment and the media at large can bring to bear on an outlier in a political party, especially a right leaning one.</p>
<p>In this case we cannot tell the true extent without knowing Matheson&#8217;s private feelings on the subject.  If he thinks that cap and trade in the form it came out of his committee is a wonderful thing, then his resistance to the pressure of his partisan peers would certainly be more a matter of self-interest than genuine moral courage.</p>
<p>However, as a general rule, I suggest that partisan outliers such as the Blue Dog Democrats typically have political inclinations that very much match the electorate that selected them.  Any electorate has every motivation to select the real McCoy rather than someone whose votes are little more than a matter of political opportunism.  Not that they are always successful, of course.  The recent election is an excellent case in point.</p>
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		<title>By: Clark</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3044</link>
		<dc:creator>Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 21:24:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3044</guid>
		<description>Mark, given his constituency I&#039;m not sure that took too much courage.  Had he voted for it he&#039;d have had a good chance of losing.  I think you&#039;ll find he votes with Republicans nearly as much as Democrats.  In many states he&#039;d be a conservative Republican.  It&#039;s just in Utah that he&#039;s the &quot;liberal.&quot;

I don&#039;t know how others define moderate.  I define it by viewing any policy issue and noting that there are people strongly opposed and strongly for and a large stretch in the middle who like the policy with modifications.  If a person favors enough middling views on most policies I call them a moderate. 

So someone like Chris Cannon was very conservative, yet on immigration he was very moderate.  (Partially why he lost re-election)  I&#039;d never call Chris a moderate though simply because it&#039;s a single policy he was moderate on.  (Actually he was moderate on a few other views as well)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, given his constituency I&#8217;m not sure that took too much courage.  Had he voted for it he&#8217;d have had a good chance of losing.  I think you&#8217;ll find he votes with Republicans nearly as much as Democrats.  In many states he&#8217;d be a conservative Republican.  It&#8217;s just in Utah that he&#8217;s the &#8220;liberal.&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know how others define moderate.  I define it by viewing any policy issue and noting that there are people strongly opposed and strongly for and a large stretch in the middle who like the policy with modifications.  If a person favors enough middling views on most policies I call them a moderate. </p>
<p>So someone like Chris Cannon was very conservative, yet on immigration he was very moderate.  (Partially why he lost re-election)  I&#8217;d never call Chris a moderate though simply because it&#8217;s a single policy he was moderate on.  (Actually he was moderate on a few other views as well)</p>
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		<title>By: Mark D.</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3043</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 20:40:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3043</guid>
		<description>I like Jim Matheson (D) - he voted against cap and trade, while sitting on the committee that was in charge of it(!).  That takes courage.

The views that most typify GOP moderates these days are liberal views on social issues such as abortion, amnesty for illegal immigrants, and sometimes health care and environmental issues.  Most are typically relatively solid on free market economics and the need for limited government.  If not, they would be Democrats.  Notable exceptions (Scozzafava anyone?) excluded, of course.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like Jim Matheson (D) &#8211; he voted against cap and trade, while sitting on the committee that was in charge of it(!).  That takes courage.</p>
<p>The views that most typify GOP moderates these days are liberal views on social issues such as abortion, amnesty for illegal immigrants, and sometimes health care and environmental issues.  Most are typically relatively solid on free market economics and the need for limited government.  If not, they would be Democrats.  Notable exceptions (Scozzafava anyone?) excluded, of course.</p>
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		<title>By: Rich Knapton</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3042</link>
		<dc:creator>Rich Knapton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 23:20:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3042</guid>
		<description>There is a lot of diversity in either wing, moderate or conservative. Nevertheless, there is an actual wing of the party called moderate. When you use the term &#039;moderate&#039; are you referencing this wing of the party? In other words, how do you define &#039;moderate&#039; as in &quot;He is a moderate?&quot;

Rich</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a lot of diversity in either wing, moderate or conservative. Nevertheless, there is an actual wing of the party called moderate. When you use the term &#8216;moderate&#8217; are you referencing this wing of the party? In other words, how do you define &#8216;moderate&#8217; as in &#8220;He is a moderate?&#8221;</p>
<p>Rich</p>
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		<title>By: Clark</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3040</link>
		<dc:creator>Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 19:16:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3040</guid>
		<description>I think there&#039;s much more diversity than &quot;moderate&quot; vs. &quot;conservative&quot; captures.

Regarding Huntsman and Romney - I see it as more coincidental they are Mormon.  I have grave issues with Romney due to his pandering and flip flopping.  Huntsman just happens to be close to my ideal candidate in a number of ways.

In one way one of the biggest disappointments with the Republican party right now is that few of the figures out there as potential leaders are appealing, the way Obama was for Dems in 2004.  Huntsman was, prior to being named Ambassador, putting out a Presidential campaign and was mentioned a lot in various press reports.  However there was an Evangelical distaste for him on numerous levels.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think there&#8217;s much more diversity than &#8220;moderate&#8221; vs. &#8220;conservative&#8221; captures.</p>
<p>Regarding Huntsman and Romney &#8211; I see it as more coincidental they are Mormon.  I have grave issues with Romney due to his pandering and flip flopping.  Huntsman just happens to be close to my ideal candidate in a number of ways.</p>
<p>In one way one of the biggest disappointments with the Republican party right now is that few of the figures out there as potential leaders are appealing, the way Obama was for Dems in 2004.  Huntsman was, prior to being named Ambassador, putting out a Presidential campaign and was mentioned a lot in various press reports.  However there was an Evangelical distaste for him on numerous levels.</p>
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		<title>By: Rich Knapton</title>
		<link>http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/2009/10/15/creationism-as-a-gop-litmus-test/comment-page-1/#comment-3039</link>
		<dc:creator>Rich Knapton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 18:05:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.libertypages.com/cgw/?p=2326#comment-3039</guid>
		<description>What do you mean by a moderate Republican? The party is split between Moderate Republicans and Conservative Republicans. The two share a number of principles but there are principles which Moderates hold that Conservatives do not. One is the nature of the Constitution. Moderate Republicans hold that the Constitution is a living document to be constantly reinterpreted. Conservatives believe the Constitution is a contract between government and people. Like any contract, to change it requires an amendment to the contract.

Therefore, if you are calling someone a moderate Republican are you saying he holds the ideals of moderate Republicans? Or, is he a conservative without holding &quot;extreme&quot; positions with the conservative wing?

Rich</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What do you mean by a moderate Republican? The party is split between Moderate Republicans and Conservative Republicans. The two share a number of principles but there are principles which Moderates hold that Conservatives do not. One is the nature of the Constitution. Moderate Republicans hold that the Constitution is a living document to be constantly reinterpreted. Conservatives believe the Constitution is a contract between government and people. Like any contract, to change it requires an amendment to the contract.</p>
<p>Therefore, if you are calling someone a moderate Republican are you saying he holds the ideals of moderate Republicans? Or, is he a conservative without holding &#8220;extreme&#8221; positions with the conservative wing?</p>
<p>Rich</p>
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